Thanks for the exchange of information, it's all gone very quiet here, and I am calling SE this week to clear up a few points, as we are unhappy with our contact there, who had never disclosed that the final licence has not yet been granted.

Best regards

G

The reply from DBF to my e-mail below. Has anyone had any joy with legals

To: <dbf.law@uol.com.br>
Subject: Fw: Property Purchase
Date: 23 June 2007



Date: 26 June 2007 19:15

D B F - law office
Property & Tax
 
BRAZIL
Porto Seguro (BA)
Rua do Cais, 30 - rooms 01 to 04 - Zip Code: 45.810 - 000
Phone / Fax: +55 73 3288-0858
--------------------------------------------
 

We have received a letter from you, a couple of days ago, in addition, we received the e-mail (below), in 23th. June 2007.
Answering its queries, I would like to clarify two points:

I - we charge fees per working hours, so, it depends on the how complex is the job;
II - we have been working for Someplace Else, providing juridical consulting.
However, whether you need any legal assistance regarding investments in Brazil, we will be able to help, even if you are interesting in any project developed by Someplace Else, inclusive because we are obligated to show every public document that support our advices, and because all projects developed by Someplace Else in Bahia are absolutely OK !
Anyway, we will be on its disposal for further clearings.
Best regards,
Danilo Blenner Fumis.

De:james.howarth2@ntlworld.com
Para:dbf.law@uol.com.br
Data:23/06/2007 08:57
Assunto:Fw: Property Purchase

 
> 
----- Original Message -----
From: james.
>
> Subject: Property Purchase
>

> Hello. I am purchasing 2 land plots near Belmonte and noted that Ready2invest had suggested using DBF to help with the legal advice.
>  My plots are not at the Plantation and this contact possibly represents a new source of clients, with whom I am in contact, purchasing either land plots or apartments. I am therefore keen to hear from you if you are able and willing to undertake the usual searches and checks on the development and it's permissions and to look at the contracts, amending them if necessary. I understand that a tax registration number [CPF] will be needed which might also be something you can help with. At present we have signed purchase agreements and are waiting on the contracts.
>  I suspect that fees might vary depending on the purchase,a land plot or an apartment.Please can you let me know what they would be for me with 2 plots, and what  the other plot holders they might pay, and also what the apartment purchasers would be charged.                                              >   The development is by Someplace Else and is called The Belmonte Resort and Residences. I must ask if you are representing them in any way so as to avoid conflict of interest.
> I look forward to hearing from you and answering any questions you may have. It would be good to have things in place for when the purchase contracts are issued. This has been delayed whilst waiting on a final licence which we are assured will be granted shortly.
>                                         Yours Sincerely James

I have the info of the office DBF at Porto Seguro.  The number is +55 7332880858 and the contact is Danilo.  I have not spoken to him yet.  Was thinking to call as there is conflicting information on the internet about whether you need to pay 15% tax on the profit when you sell.  Failing that I will ask the taxes themselves.  Luckily I speak Portuguese..

I bought a 2 bed appartment in Arraial D'Ajuda, Porto Seguro from a real estate agent recently.  It's on a condo which has existed for over 10years so I have no experience with off site plans.  This area is 50km south of Belmonte and is already an established tourist area mainly with the Brazilians but as of last year with the Dutch & Italians.  Property prices are more expensive than Belmonte but cheaper than Europe.  Also still some good deals to be found.

I plan to go out there for a couple of months and will also look at Belmonte.  I've been to Brazil 3 times and I highly recommend it!  Great people, food & cocktails, music, dance, lifestyle...  If I can be of any help let me know.

of course you have to have an independent local lawyer. i know nothing about someplace else (who may or may not be 100% reputable), but it beggars belief that you're buying without visiting the site and speaking to local lawyers, officials etc. it goes without saying investing in a place like Brasil is completely different to europe. i write as an experienced investor in south american real estate, and when i speak to the people at these UK based shows i can assure you the vast majority know next to nothing about south american real estate. PAY WHATEVER IT TAKES TO GET THE RIGHT LEGAL ADVICE

Msg. re: Belmonte resort developed by Someplace Else

Are there 2 Belmonte resorts - one marketed by ready2invest?  The threads are a little confusing.  I've been looking at another board - Porto Dos Corais in Natal - and those folks recommend using Manzanares International as their independent lawyer.  They also have an office in London. 

I haven't received any contracts yet (or any info since the deposit) so it may be a bit early but I'll try to get a contact name and see what they charge to review them and do title/planning permit searches.

Jim,

Sorry it has taken a while for me to come back on this I have been away for a while.

Ready2invest are liaising with the legal representitive, I have not yet had any direct communication with them and do not have an e-mail address.

As I get any news I will keep the board informed.

Regards

I think that as different threads are created its going to be really difficult to follow.  Does anybody have any ideas on how we might better manage this?  Feel free to send me a personal message as I have a few ideas.
Stefan

I think that as different threads are created its going to be really difficult to follow.  Does anybody have any ideas on how we might better manage this?  Feel free to send me a personal message as I have a few ideas.
Stefan

Hi Jim

Ginlink, thought to keep the group posting going so that  everyone gets a peep , possibly encouraging more contributions. Never thought to check on Bella Maya postings for S.E. track record, so thanks for that. Lessons to be learned on both sides eh! 

 So you are into the Reserve too. Wish I had more to invest as that looks exciting. My wife wants to stay at home [ Brighton/London ] with new projects but they don't have the wow factor.

Must admit I read the associated costs bit including the 2% legal and construed that as projected costs of our own legal representation. Never occured that it would be to cover S.E.'s legal costs. If this is the case am I being naive to think this a little cheeky.

Hi everyone,

*My posts just relate to the Belmonte Residences development from Someplace Else.*

Jim, it must've been lonely for you with just one post sitting here on its own! It's good there are a few of us now - obviously interest kicked off after the Place in the Sun exhibition, and I understand that S.E. are exhibiting at Hampton Court flower show in the summer, plus advertising will start as they get their plans more developed.

Hi guys

 Good to see that the posts are becoming more regular now - I like Jim haven't checked for a few weeks but will start making more regular visits to the site now there is more activity.  It’s good to be in touch with others involved in both B.R and the Plantation.  With regards to Dvushka and Jims open question about Lawyers, I have made contact with "The International Property Law Centre" at "www.internationalpropertylaw.com" with regards to their service and costs.  I have received a response back from Sonia Rodrigues (Head of the Portuguese Property Department specializing in Brazilian property law) and in summary they offer two services. A basic service costing £750.00 and a more comprehensive service at £2500 (I can forward  more details on request) - quite a marked difference in costs but then you don't mind paying more if the service really does make the transaction as easy as it can be.  I am yet undecided whether to use this company, but one thing is for sure, I will be getting the contracts looked over by a qualified professional.  My limited experience has taught me that it is a necessity.  I am nearing the end of an 18 months purchase in Bulgaria and the prelim contracts were amended numerous times before the final one was drafted as it contained a whole host of anomalies and discrepancies which I would just not have spotted.  Has anybody received prelim contracts for the B.R?

Stefan

Hi Quackers, I forgot to ask who , if anyone, you used to check contracts etc.. As Someplace Else clients we have not yet had ours and need to get this sorted for when the final licences are granted.

                                                                               Jim

Hello David, Stefan,Ginlink and Dvushka. Sorry that I didn't spot sooner that you were responding to my shot in the dark . I had stumbled on this site and it was a lonely couple of months after first registering Belmonte. I gave up checking. It's still the same story with my only other investment outside the UK in Sofia, Bulgaria.

It's good to have the Plantation info to add to and compare facts,figures and photos of the area. I am also encouraged to see that the prediction of tourism growth may make for good investment, though this might not be what you are after. I am not sure of my stratergy with 2 land plots, but might never use them myself.

I'm not brilliant at the due dilligence bit. I first became aware of Someplce Else at last years Place in the Sun show . One of the directors, Ben, made a big impression, standing out amongst a pannel of speakers at a seminar. I decided that I would follow up on his thoughts on Brazil. At that point Belmonte wasn't even being marketed. By the time I contacted S.E.  Mike Holwill was in the process of putting it all together. I've only spoken on the phone but he sounded just right to me, both friendly and informative. I own up to going with the company and would have chosen another of their projects if Belmonte had not been in the offing.

The Plantation is very affordable with it's smaller plot sizes at a similar list price/m2 to Belmonte Residences. The build costs of smaller villas and proximity to Belmonte give it appeal.At the discounted price it could work out that gains on a 2nd plot might part fund building on first. As pointed out by Ready2invest, S.E. have still to gain final licence due to a change of staff at planning office but I am assured that this will happen by July at latest.

B.R. is a 5 min shuttle ride to Belmonte. Pro is that the beach could be quieter, especially considering  900? plots in Plantation compared to 150ish in B.R..Con is that its more than a stagger back from the bar.The build cost will be higher at B.R. if one takes advatage of allowable footprint with plot sizes from 600-1000m2. Landscaping will include lagoon, small river and extensive planting. Amenities and scope for individuality in villa style are offered. 

I noted the recomendation of DBF Law Office in Porto Seguro by Ready2 invest. Mike from S.E. said he could suggest some UK based firms that might charge about £2000. Sounds expensive to me. Maybe we can join together to get better rates. I think a Brazillian rather than a UK based firm.

The apartments in B.R. certainly have prime position. I might be looking to rent if I go ahead and build on one or both of my plots. Have to wait and see how the funds etc. stack up. I can't believe I have more info from S.E. than you . My compilation includes something on an overveiw of Brazil and a bit on Belmonte and surrounds. There is a site plan and apts. floor plans. Earlier this month Mike sent another update explaining delay and there were a couple of shots of site. I'm sure they will send this if you haven't already got it.

Hope we can all keep in touch. It seems that Eye on Worldwide gives us an excellent opportunity to do so.

                                                      Jim

Stefan,

I have bought one plot and optioned another (effectively fixing the price today for 12 months, with a decision made next April), the plots vary in size mine is c.4,600sq.ft with planning approved.

What is the pricing like at the residences?

Regards

Quackers

Quackers

Since my last post I have secured a 1 bed apt. in Block A - I visited the offices of someplaceelse yesterday in London to chat through a few things with one of the consultants and came away feeling that I had definitely made the right decision.  I was given the sales brochure for the "Bella Maya" development in Belize which is being marketed through SPE to gauge the quality which I've been told we are to expect from the Belmonte residences and that dev. looks fantastic.  From what I understand too, things are at the pre-release stage and I agree that things do appear a little sketchy but hopefully as the development becomes more heavily marketed more detail will be made available.

Have you bought land or an apt.?

Stefan

Hello Quackers - I have sent you a private message.

Regards
ginlink

Ginlink,

Do you have any information you could forward on the resort and residences?  I am buying land with planning on The Plantation Belmonte, as marketed by Ready2invest and colliers.

Regards

Quackers

Jim

I am buying a 2 bed apartment at Belmonte, as seen at the exhibition at Excel.  So far as I understand it, it's still at pre-release stage yet, and some of the information is a bit sketchy.  We have had a drawing of the planned layout and also floorplan for the block and the apartment design.

It all looks good so far, but is a little nerve-wracking.

Stefan,

Do you have any info. on the development you are considering or are you looking at the plantation?

Hi Jim2

I'm currently looking at this development having just gone to overseas exhibition at Excel.  Have you bought here or just considering it?  The glossy brochure looks very interesting and given me much food for thought.

Stefan

Jim2,

I have just bought one and optioned a second plot at The Plantation Belmonte through Ready2invest - Is this the same resort?

Regards

David