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EOW Team | furnishaldeiaformosa |
Hello everybody,
I'm portuguese and some Irish people I know have bought some apartments in Plot E of Aldeia Formosa.
As things are not going as planned (the deeds were supposed to be signed at 31/12/2006), they have asked me some help.
I have conducted a few researches and I am afraid that I do not have good news at all, since I have discovered some problems related with taxes and court claims.
I have read that some of you have already signed the deeds but some don't. It is not clear what is the present situation with «Aldeia Formosa» and I did not understood what happened with Cabanas Gardens.
Is there anyone willing to exchange some information about «Aldeia Formosa»? As we say here in Portugal «United we are stronger»...
Best regards to you all | nc |
Hi All,
When this properies will be complited?
Thanks
Marta | martat265 |
Hi franklij
I heard the weather hasn't been too good over there-should we be fitting our cars with flotation aids before we come over?!
pdoff | pdoff |
Trace, superior finishes???. Underground swimming pool!!!! | franklij |
Trace,you just don't get it do you?.You talk about intolerance and community spirit and then in your one and only post on the other forum you displayed a total lack of understanding or symapthy for other peoples problems by spouting on about how great your lawyer was,how easy your purchase had been,how we should stop complaining and get on with it etc etc.You had read for months about how people were struggling to get some decent legal representation but did you think of recommending your lawyer for other people to use?,not a chance!.
You are too selfish and self centred for such kind deeds,all you care about is your own situation and to heck with everyone else's,that is the arrogance you have displayed not us. | blacky |
I'm not surprised all you arrogant bullyboys stick together and continue to harass another person and ignore the point of the forum.
It's about community spirit of present and future owners. Will you still have the same intolerence to others and their opinions when or if ever you become owners? Perhaps your agression will have subsided by then and you be able to relax and enjoy the apartments you have fought for.
Until then, in your words, this smug person will enjoy Cabanas and hope that my neighbours will be gentlemen or at least polite
| trace |
Trace
If I remember rightly you started all this nonsense with your ridiculous claims of harassment and basically called us all a bunch of losers.If you can't take the flak you shouldn't be dishing it out in the first place.We are not having the easy ride that you did,through no fault of our own,so if you have nothing constructive to contribute don't bother. | pdoff |
Trace,
After reading recent messages that were posted and more especially your personal comments about Blacky, I felt compelled to respond. Let me for the record, put a few things straight. YOU withdrew from our present forum of your own free will, no one blocked you as you claim. It IS true that you invoked negative comments from many of the forum members- entirely because of your ridiculous, inflamatory and arrogant attitude to the rest of the buyers. Everyone of course has the right to air their views, but Im afraid, yours were reflective of someone bordering on the paranoia and you have completely isolated yourself as a result.
Regarding Blacky, ANY of our forum members will testify to the fact that he is as sound a guy as you are ever going to come across. He is extrememly clued up on whats going on over there, is willing to share his assessment of things for the benefit of all - and has a great sense of humour to boot (something Trace that you could seriously do with)! Ignore him (and the rest of the forum members) at your peril.
| tealeaves |
Trace,I think you need to take a look at yourself not me.If you think my flotation aid gag was anything more than a joke then you obviously have no sense of humour whatsoever!.
Don't forget,the reason you are on this forum like Billy no mates getting all cuddly with John is because your smug,'I'm all right Jack,so bugger you lot' attitude rightly brought a torrent of criticism your way from all the other members.
Don't give me all this 'all I want to do is share' claptrap because it doesn't wash,you have shown your true colours in the past and now you start crying about personal assaults after YOU had previously accused me of blocking you from the forum and being the 'prophet of doom'!.
I have nothing against you personally,but I'm afraid you cannot be surprised if people don't exactly want to exchange too many pleasantries with you after what you have previously said. | blacky |
JoCameron
I liked your story about Solmontemar and honestly I would like very much to believe you, but I already know that story since 10 year ago. This is the story that they are telling to everyone. I think you continue in ilusion.
I'm glad you investment have doubled, so is mine. Can you tell me how many apartments in Parque dos Reis have license? I can Inform you. None. None of the apartments can be sold since a few year ago. Try to sell yours and you will see.
It's true that Miralgar is not owned by Solmontemar. Did you know that the owner of Miralgar is the ex-wife of the principal owner of Solmontemar. When they made Parque dos Reis and start to promote Aldeia Formosa they were still married. Take out your conclusions.
As I know Solmontemar and Solturigest have comon owners. So the people are the same.
It's also true that no one in Parque dos Reis payd the condominio, did Solturigest payd the condominio of their apartments and the condomino referente to the apartments that have from the owners to explore. The reason why many people don't pay is because they are not the real owners of the apartments, it's Solmontemar, and they came again with the same 10 year old history, that you know very well. The people are tired of that story, so they don't pay, that is the true.
Since July 2006 they don't pay me. I quit my rental contract in 20 of january this year. In the week after they sent me a letter asking me for money for the condominio of this year, or they will put me a process in court. Do you think this action is from a normal company, or is from a company that only want money from us and don't want to pay to anyone.
When I was using my apartament for my hollidays, I always payd them on time. After give them my apartment for rental, always paid me with 3, 4 months delayed. Now they owned me a lot of money, and they ask me for more ! Incredible!
This is why I don't believe them anymore.
Take care
MF
| mf |
Blacky
why are you such a horrible person?
This forum is about people purchasing a property in another country and sharing experiences. Most people participating do so for that purpose
Your personal written assult on me , a person you don't know, is very upsetting. | trace |
Trace
As per usual you are talking complete tosh!.I am not the administrator or controller of the forum and as such would have no idea how to 'block' anyone from using it!.
As for being 'lucky' to have completed your purchase,I'm glad you feel that way.You are obviously easily pleased and don't mind in the slightest that you will not get the facilities that were promised you originally.
Hopefully,the campaign being waged by us 'prophets of doom' will pay off in the end and we will at least get our promised pool area.If so,feel free to use it anytime- I'll even lend you my brand new flotation aid,its made from the finest quality lead money can buy!!. | blacky |
Hi John,
like you we are proud owners in phase 1.
I also joined this forum a while ago to tell other buyers how things are progressing in the ongoing development as we travel regularly to our apartment. Unfortunately Blacky who seems to be 'the prophet of doom' also stopped me from posting any further updates. Blacky and his 'group of owners' who keep complaining they own nothing set up a separate whinging forum. I was invited to join in and when I gave my opinion i was 'blocked' from their litlle group. Good luck to them .
If other genuine potential buyers waiting patiently to get their keysare interested in receiving updates of progress from those of us lucky to have completed our purchase I am more than willing to do so. John I'm sure you would feel the same. | trace |
John,you still seem to have your head in the sand here,putting aside the ownership of the land in front of Plot D,who exactly is going to build this mythical pool of yours - Solmontemar?.I don't think so they have washed their hands of this project and are on the brink of bankrupcy,owing money all over the place.That leaves Topjam then,oh oh they have already met with our lawyer and stated categorically that they will do no such thing!.So who's going to do it then?,maybe Tommy Walsh will rent one of the apartments for the summer and knock one up whilst he's doing nothing!!.
We would all love to get some good news and although on the face of it you seem to make some good points,in the end until you or anyone else can tell us for certain when/where and by whom the pool will be built it is just not conceivable I'm afraid.
For your information,I enquired about a front line T1 unit last month that is for sale fully furnished for 155K euro.This is 20K less than T1's were to buy off-plan 3 years ago and it has been on the market for at least a year,the estate agent told me that they were open to 'reasonable offers'.So,if you honestly think your unit has 'doubled' in value good luck to you,try and find someone to buy it and that will confirm who is the more realistic about its true value. | blacky |
| P.S. My intention in joining this chat room was only to attempt to inform concerned individuals who perhaps wanted some enlightening of this situation, but in no way was it to wage war. When I go on holidays to the Algarve, I unfortunately can never sit on the beach and relax, my wife and sometimes grandchildren do that, I go to the registry offices, city hall, speak to fellow lawyers. etc etc. The only message I wanted to get across is that no one should worry that their units and the pool will not be completed, I am absolutely sure they will, maybe in more time then initially expected, but nevertheless the work has begun and they will be completed and all below concerned and those not concerned can sit by the pool next summer. (with my wife and sometimes grandchildren)! Cheers! John | JoCameron |
| Blacky and others- I am not a rep for anyone, the pool will be built and I never wrote that Solmontemar owned the land, what I wrote is that the pool belongs to the subdivision. In subdivisions you have to give to the City Hall land when you ask for building area and this land was "given" to the Camara, it is calculated as a percentage. Years ago when this was done it was agreed by way of contract with the Camara that there was to be a pool built there with funds of the developer not the Camara. In portuguese it is call "cedencia de propriedade". Regarding your 5 000Euros that the company topjam was registered for- that is by law the minimum amount a company must be registered for and show it has in the bank, purely for registration purposes, that doesn't mean the company is worth 5,000Euros! Ask your famous lawyer is the above is not true? As to your concern with solmontemar owing taxes, the best thing that could have happened was the fact they sold m d and J to topjam. I have a company certificate for topjam which I just acquired by email from the Registry Office in Tavira and no where does it state that SOlmontemar has anything to do with Topjam, as well as land registry office certificate showing a sale and stamp duty paid. With your logic I guess solmontemar also did not sell lots I H and G to Baniff Fund? Was that also a joke? By the way I bought my property 6 years ago in ALdeia Formosa and yes I have doubled my investment.!!! This is the last time I join your chat room, as you have made up your minds and quite frankly I have no time to spend with ill advised individuals who believe only what they want to believe. John | JoCameron |
For your further information John,our lawyer has established that Topjam were 'formed' by Solmontemar in May 2007,they have a company value of a whopping 5,000 euros and as they now own plots D,J and M our original promissory contracts with Solmontemar are now completely worthless.
All Topjam are doing is completing the apartments in these plots,nothing else.Our lawyer has met with these people,and they have told her that they will be providing absolutely NO facilities,pools or otherwise.In fact,the land in front of my block in plot D where I was promised a pool was going to be built has never been owned by Solmontemar at all,it belongs to the Tavira camara and always has!.So for you to ask what Solmontemar have done wrong is an insult to all the people on this development who have been lied to and cheated by these people for well over 2 years and now see the real prospect of either losing their deposits or ending up with a development far inferior to the one that was promised them!. | blacky |
Hi John,
I'm beginning to think that you are actually a rep of Solmontemar or some other sort of ignorant joker!.You have absolutely no idea about the current situation that is happening here,there are a group of owners who have got together and appointed a very good lawyer who has had meetings with Topjam (Solmontemar) and done various company/land searches and the outcome is totally disastrous for all concerned!.
They are totally bereft of any sort of funds and have hung us all out to dry,why do think that between late 2005 and late 2007 there was not a worker on site or a brick laid.The place was a complete ghost town,Solmontemar owe fortunes in tax to the fiscal authorities and have a reputation that is lower than a snake's belly!.
Unfortunately,we have learned too late what a mistake we have all made,for you to come on here spouting this nonsense is beyond belief!Our lawyer in Portugal paints a very black picture,but at least she is being honest and is doing her best to help,you my friend are in lala land!.
You reckon that you've doubled your original investment,well hopefully you have,but take a look at the amount of units that are now for sale as people bale out.Try and sell yours for 'double' and see how you get on,my bet is it will still be on the market 3 years from now,if not longer!.
Don't get me wrong,we'd all love to trust your judgement,unfortunately our experience and the advice of our lawyer tells us that you are completely deluded!. | blacky |
| Blacky-for your information and the others, Your information is not correct. The pool belongs to the entire subdivision not only to G,H & I. Regardless of who builds. That is the law and that is the way the entire subdivision call it Aldeia Formosa or Cabanna Gardens has been registed in the Registry Office of Tavira. Topjam is not Solmontemar, by the way M,D and J is called Formosa Gardens. These three block were sold to TOPJam as were GH and I sold to Baniff Fund over a year ago. It will be TOPjam and Baniff who will be building the pool and Solmontemar - solmontemar has money by way of Bank Guarantee with the Camara (City Hall) when they initiated this project years ago. Unfortunately, most have only received information from what I can gather from the below messages from MRI and Parador the real estate agencies and the lawyers that I would assume were refered by these same real estate agencies. What I can not understand is why some are so concerned with Solmontemar, has anyone lost any money? is your concern that fact that the building has been delayed? I was in cabannas during easter and it looked to me like MDJ are being built, they had cranes and a workforce working. There is something else I think you and the others should know about MRI and Parador. When they sell a property they make a minimum commission of 10% plus tax in Portugal it is 21%. They are paid this amount on the signing of the Agreement of Purchase and Sale and not on the closing date. SO you see when you hand over a 15% or 20% deposit they immediately keep their at least 10%. Which means if SOlmontemar had to give back the deposit so do they, which I can't see them doing!!!!!!!! John | JoCameron |
John,the new company Topjam have informed us that they are NOT providing any facilities on Aldeia Formosa whatsoever,especially pool areas.The blocks you refer to ie G H & I are actaully now a completely seperate development called Cabanas Gardens and any pools etc belong to those owners not us on Aldeia Formosa.I have heard that it is possible we may be allowed to use their pool,but it will be chargeable.
Solmontemar are all but bankrupt and owe money to all and sundry,this is why they have formed this new company called Topjam and basically told us all that they have no money to pay us back our deposits and that we have to sign new contracts with Topjam or get lost!.
So although MF may have got some of his facts wrong regards Parque dos Reis,his advice about Solmontemar being as bent as the proverbial 12 bob note is actually factually correct and anyone who has bought a unit in blocks D,J & M would most certainly agree with him!. | blacky |
I just read your message mf, and I think you should get your information straight before making the claim you are and trying to frighten other buyers.
1st. Solmontemar did construct Parque dos Reis, which is an Aparthotel, they sold solturigest a few years back, and the new company may not have paid the rentals, as you know. The bank is not trying to take over anything. Get your facts straight and don't invent. I and you do not have our licenca because the Camara will not issue it because they have been delayed in an approvial over fire and safety issues because the law changed. I have been in contact with Solmontemar and the camara and I have no doubt that it is the slow camara which is to blame. Secondly, out of 125 apartments only 30 do not have the licence. The rest have closed and have owners, which by the way none of which do not want to pay the condominium fees and therefore the condiminium corporation doesn't have money to fix the elevators- forgot to mention that did you?????
Miralgar does not belong to Solmontemar, never did, I should know because I bought my 2nd apartment through them in Aldeia Formosa, which I have closed and am very happy with. The real estate board closed them and another 20 agencies in Monte Gordo because they did not have their real estate licence in order. The owner was thinking of retiring anyways when I spoke to her and couldn't bother in doing all the now schooling necessary with the new guidelines, to reopen. Shame on you for your misleading and dishonest message. YOu should get your facts straight before you accuse unjustly.
For Aldeia Formosa owners, the pool will only be built after lots L G H r built. I spoke to the individuals who are building ,are a bank fund. The pool for obvious reasons can not be built until then. Regarding the new owners of M D and J the new owners are not Solmontmar they like the builders of LGH are different builders. For the curious, I am the owner of an apartment in Aldeia Formosa Lote B and the owner of an apartment in Parque dos Reis in Monte Gordo, which I bought both through Miralgar. I have no complaints to the contrary, as my investment has more than doubled in value. I am also a solicitor in London and love the east coast of the Algarve. None of you need worry, as some know others not in Portugal things work slowly, and as the saying goes when in Rome........... John
| JoCameron |
I saw you messages in the net, looking for Solmontemar that is the constructer of Aldeia Formosa. If this is true, I would like to inform you that this company made a building in Monte Gordo called Parque dos Reis, that I acquire an apartment 10 years ago.
Since then I'm waiting for the license of habitation, so I could sell it.
But much worst then me is many other persons that acquire the apartment in the last stage of construction 7, 8 years ago, give the money to confirm, and until today they don't have the apartment. Now the banks want to takeover the apartments with no refund to the buyers.
They also have a company called Solturigest, that rent the apartments of the other apartment owners in Parque dos Reis. The result is that they rent the apartments, receive the money and did'nt pay to the owners.
So this company is very dangerous. Be very very careful to make business with them because they are impossible to contact and they don't fill the contracts.
The company Miralgar in Monte Gordo, that is from the same owner then Solmontemar as already been closed by the Portuguese autorities, because they were selling the apartments twice.
So be Carefull
M. | mf |
hi all
just wondering how ur devel is doin? i have bought an apartment in cabanas gdns.
regards
michael guinness | guinney |
Dear All;
Does anyone have updated photos of the project that they can post for us showing the progress since December 2007.
Thank you,
T | tcooper |
We are Irish also and just received a portugeuse letter from solmontemar to advise the same. We have been trying to contact Ana and getting no joy! Will keep you posted. MRI has not been back in touch with us either.
| Sla |
Hi all,
We are irish and have bought in Block M. Solmentar have gone bust and have been taken over by a different company called Topjam. Our solicitor Ana Viera has told us that we have no choice but to stay with this company as they will not honour the deposits paid to Solmentar. Topjam say they will not be finished on till August 2009. We have asked MRI to find out what is going on but typically they have not responded. Tojam are to issue ammended promissary contracts which removes there liability for any delay claims. Would like to Know if anyone else has had any similar feedback.
KS/DS | ks |
Hi stotty,
We are Irish and purchased in phase 1 also, the last block beside the underground carpark. We signed last May and are extremely happy with our apartment. We didn't use any agents, we bought through the Sales Office. Other than the delay in signibg we have had no problems, in fact we 've had the keys to the apartment since January 2007.
We too are concerned about access to the new development as thats where our swimming pools wiil be! We are travelling over on 20th January so we will also ask questions.
We will also report progress on the building works for those of you still waiting to enjoy the benefits of your new apartment | trace |
Hi all,
Recently found this site, which makes interesting reading.
We bought an apartment in Phase 1 of Aldeia Formosa (through MRI), and completed on 1 June 2007. It's in what was originally referred to as Building 8. Very happy with the apartment itself and the location - Cabanas is beautiful. Still a few minor snags left, though, and with a combination of MRI & Solmontemar to resolve them, I'm not overly optimistic.
Like most of you, we've been concerend about the issues with Solmontemar and the lack of progress. Our main concern, though, is not about when the remaining development will be completed (although it's in our interest for that to be sooner rather than later). It's whether the Phase 1 owners will have any access to the remainder of Aldeia Formosa.
We spoke to the Loja do Condominio people just before Xmas - they're maintaining the Phase 1 going forward. They said that with there being new developers, they don't know whether they (LdC) will have any involvement in subsequent phases. This could also mean that Phase 1 owners are frozen out from the rest of the development. Do any other Phase 1 owners have any other info about this ? LdC tell us that c. 90% of Phase 1 owners are Portuguese, but it seems that at least some of the other 10% are posting here.
We're in touch with MRI trying to see if they have obtained the legal opinion they said they would get in July, and how relevant this might be. Our contract with Solmontemar isn't crystal clear about what happens if they hand over to someone else, but we'll keep digging.
I've posted a couple of pix taken on New Year's Eve from our balcony. Similar to Howie's, but a bit more of a view from above. Talking of New Year's Eve, would anyone know why the fireworks were set off in Cabanas at 1.00 am rather than at midnight ?! | Stotty |
| Well done Howie,finally a flicker of light at the end of of this long tunnel! | pdoff |
Hi Howie,
Thanks for the good news and the pictures - it's great to see some action! Hopefully we will see progress each time someone visits and takes photos. | lapd |
All,
Got back from Portugal on Monday...posted a bunch of photos, things looking good for a 2008 completion (hopefully)
Howie
| Howie |
We are going out to Portugal on 2nd January.We will visit the site and report on any developments. | tooftoof |
| Hi All, welcome back. What happended there then ? Anyhow, Parador have sent me a copy of photos taken onsite last week, similar to Brazilid. The builders onsite have indeed been clearing the site and have taken delivery of new materials. They state building work is due to commence in earnest in January. Can anyone confirm this info. | blackett1 |
| Ted and Pdoff,please respond to the emails I have sent you asap. | blacky |
| Thanks for the great news lapd and for the photos brazild.If Blacky and Howie can confirm things are genuinely moving out there it will be the best possible Christmas present! | pdoff |
Hi all,
Like many of you, I have just read the email update at the Aldeia Formosa site. It does seem strange that especially at holiday time, the diggers suddently appear _ maybe Im just being cynical , but it will be good to have your assessment of things Howie & Blackie, now that I will trust! By the way how did some of you find out your appartments were sold twice - were you contacted by the solicitor or had you to do your own search? Teddyz, let us know how the process of changing solicitor goes and if it is worth the hassle - you know how nothing in Portugal is straightforward!
| tealeaves |
| I posted some photos of work being carried out on the site you can view them on progress photos. | brazild |
I'll be there on the 20th of December so I'm going to pop down to the site and see whats going on.
P.S. I'll take my camera this time !
| Howie |
| Understand your caution Ted as we have had so many disappointments in the past,but at least this is better than nothing!.I will be on site next Thursday,camera in hand so we will see if this sudden burst of activity is a publicity stunt for MRI's benefit or not.I also intend to ask the sales girl what name she has against owning my unit.If she doesn't come back with mine right away then the rumours of fraudelent activity will no doubt be strengthened.If anyone wants me to try the same tactic with their unit,please PM me and I'll do my best!. | blacky |
Hi All,
At last some good news from MRI!
Like everyone else, I wrote to Darragh MacAnthony (yesterday) and have received several calls today - none of which I was able to take. However, they left a message to say they were e mailing all their clients.
The mail (from LIFEtime Aftersales) arrived at 8.00pm and it shows pictures of workmen on the site. I have tried to copy it here but it wont let me. Essentially it says:
- construction works have started
- the construction company is JMC Construciones LDA
- they have been contracted to complete the project in 2008.
- at the moment on site there are heavy trucks, earth moving equipment and labourers, preparing the site for the site offices and workforce
- in January they will start the structures that are yet to be completed.
-
they say - "even though there is still no official notification from the developers themselves, the presence of the workforce confirms our belief, that it is very much in the developer’s interest to complete the project, because the build stage is so advanced in some cases - it would simply not make financial sense NOT to complete given how much capital the developer has tied up. What we would urge all clients to do at this stage given there is now work taking place on site, is to remain patient, and we will update you regularly on the progress"
| lapd |
|
I also had Ana and hav changed. I am in the process of preparing a complaint for the Law Bar Association in Portugal.
If you want to send a complaint to the Law Bar Association the address is:
Ordem dos Advogados
Conselhor de Deontologia
Rua Antero de Quental nº 9, 3º
8000-210 Faro
| teddyz |
tealeaves,
I advise your firstly reading back over the last few pages of communications on this site.
Get a feel for what others have been saying, and what we know.
Stick with it and don't worry. We will collectively organise soon to try and move this debacle on one way or another.
Enda
| Enda |
Hi
Just checking is anyone in Lote A. (Apt D was to be mine!!) Anyone else think they own this one?? I've been definitively told by parador to pull out as several people seem to own this apt. Getting the deposit back now is the big challenge!! | disheartened |
Teddyz,
Did you new solicitor find anything out that isnt current knowlege ?
Regards
Howie
| Howie |
Has anyone else used M R I rentals to rent any propertys in the past? | brazild |
Hi all, i also emailed Darragh Mac Anthony and got the following reponse from one of his directors --We are of course aware of the regrettable delays in Aldeia Formosa, and the situation is unfortunately unchanged, namely that the developers have been promising to re-start the building works sometime soon, but are unwilling to put this in writing to clients, so it is a frustrating waiting game for all buyers in this development. Both MRI and other agents have made numerous approaches to the developers to pressure them into action, but to date this has been unsuccessful - the only other option for clients at this stage is legal action against the developer for non-delivery, and you should have received advice from your lawyers in relation to this.
As a result of this we have asked the advice of the law firm NDR who represent a number of clients, and have proposed that they write a demand to the developer informing them that they must communicate their plans and commitments in writing to clients. We hope to have more news on this in the coming week.
As you have stated in your email, there are other clients, who have bought with a number of other agents, who are in the same position, because it is the developer, not MRI who are at fault here. We will of course do all we can and hope that this new approach from the lawyers will bring positive results. We can only pass on information as we have it, and are not prepared to communicate rumour or hearsay to clients as this would cause greater confusion. | hippo |
| I e-mailed the address, given by teddyz, on friday and received a call from one of his chief executives on Saturday. It was inconvenient for me to speak at the time so he is ringing me again on Monday. | franklij |
Hi Teddyz,
MRI did phone, as promised, to tell me what they could. I was told that MRI directors were meeting on Saturday and that Aldeia Formosa was on the agenda. They said they would contact me on Monday but I am working late so they said they would email me. I'll share their comments as soon as I get them. | lapd |
| Hi All, for your info we are Block D, Building 17, 2nd Floor 'A'. Encouraged by last piece of news from Parador, re building work reverting back to Topjam. Maybe good news! | blackett1 |